What do children need before having conversations?

In my effort to educate other parents about the things I wish I'd known and understood as we were beginning autism intervention, I am sharing with you the words (with permission) of a brilliant teacher.

After my girl regressed, I wanted nothing more than to get her development back on track, to give her words so she could talk to me. I had all the confidence in the world that the vocabulary we had her memorizing would not be useful without a foundation of non-verbal conversations, first. The more she memorized, the less communicated. I was shocked by that. I was told we'd get something very different from our behavioral approach, not the robotic, prompt dependent child who did not interact on her own.

Yesterday's post is Dr Jim's wisdom about communication myths. Go here to read it. Today's post is closely related. Below is more insight from Dr James D MacDonald, this time, some specifics about what children DO need before having conversations.

I wish I'd understood this concept when my daughter was just turning two years old. We went the behavioral route, which didn't do what we thought it would, and it created a lot of problems that we are still unraveling at 11. I hope I help someone avoid the mistakes I made.

WHAT DO CHILDREN NEED BEFORE HAVING CONVERSATIONS?

by Dr James D MacDonald

A Conversation is any meaningful exchange of ideas, information or emotion between two persons. The beginnings of conversations lie in skills young children can develop. If they are not developed, older children can still learn conversations but they must also learn the early skills that build them. Those skills are:

1. Social interaction habits
2. Initiating and responding
3. Imitating and learning from others’ models.
4. Taking turns in a give and take style
5. Being reciprocal- sharing each other’s meaning.
6. Staying in interactions more than briefly.
7. Communicating for a response not just at someone.
8. Listening and responding in kind.
9. Showing interest in what another says.
10. Having something too say to another.
Nonverbal children who have active relationships with others can learn these early skills. For persons without conversation skills, they are the keys to build in them.

They also need to interact frequently with people who are

matched
balanced
responsive
sharing control
and

being playful and emotionally attached.

Conversations are partnerships and so this requires both he child and his partners to change and join the child's developmental path.

I'd like to see some examples of your children's conversations and your struggles in building them with your child. (Note from Penny: Dr Jim's web site provides info about an internet location to chat with him and other parents about early foundations of communication.)

Common Myths About Communication: DON'T BELIEVE THEM

Here's another important message from Dr. James. D. MacDonald, aka "Dr. Jim", from Communicating Partners and Play to Talk.

COMMON MYTHS ABOUT CONVERSATON
“DON’T BELIEVE THEM!”

by Dr James D MacDonald

Our 35+ years of clinical research with hundreds of families and professionals reveal several common beliefs about Conversation.

These beliefs can seriously limit a child’s success in life.
(MacDonald, 2004; MacDonald and Mitchell, 2002)

1. Conversation skills come after language.
2. Children have conversation skills needed to generalize learning to daily lives.
3. Conversations come automatically with language.
4. Conversations at home are not important
5 Conversations cannot be taught
6. Conversations do not belong in therapy and education
7. Parents cannot teach conversation.
5. Questions and monologues are sufficient conversation skills.
7. Conversation skills cannot be learned.
8 Conversations do not help a child learn
9. Conversations do not belong in education
10. Conversation is not necessary for success in life.


IMPORTANT FINDINGS ABOUT CONVERSATION ONES THAT CHALLENGE THE MYTHS ABOVE.

Widespread research findings show the above assumptions to be untrue and support the following conclusions that are the bases of the Communicating Partners approach to Conversation.

1. Conversation skills should be learned long before speech

2. The earlier they are learned; the easier conversation develops.

3. Many schools teach cognitive, and behavioral skills without the conversation skills needed to make them work in daily life.

4. Many educational approaches actually train children to NOT have conversations.

5. Conversations definitely do not come automatically with language: many have much language and little conversation.

6. Without conversations, people appear much less competent than they really are.

7. Children are often evaluated (diagnosed) improperly when they have limited conversation skills.

9. Conversations simply mean going back and forth meaningfully with partner with any behaviors—actions, sounds, as well as words.

10. Conversation skills can be learned as well as any other social skills:

11 We actually learn more from conversations than from being taught.

12. Daily social routines foster greater learning than academic or behavioral drills because they allow conversations about immediate experiences.

13. We should not expect conversations to be easily learned in academic settings unless they are deliberately structured.

Thank you for thinking about these life-changing ideas.

The Critical Difference Between LANGUAGE and COMMUNICATION

Dr James MacDonald from Communicating Partners posted another beautiful word picture for parents that illustrates the difference between language and communication. His words remind me of the picture that Barbara Rogoff paints in Apprenticeship in Thinking when she describes the rich communication between parent and youngster before words are a currency of communication. Communication comes first in development. We missed that in our first attempt at intervention (behavioral). Thank goodness for a developmental do-over.

The critical differences between LANGUAGE AND COMMUNICATION

by Dr James D MacDonald

One common problem I run into all the time is the difficulty in appreciating the difference between Language and Communication

Language refers to the words,,,,,, sentences, vocabulary and all that goes into knowing what words stand for what experiences. This a cognitive issue- like do you know what a 'dog' is?

Communication, however is a social event- it requires the persons to send or receive a message- the message can be words, or sounds or movements.

Communication is the source of language, consequently the more a child communicates and interacts the more langauge he will learn . Also the more cognitively developed he will be. We all learn much more in social interaction.

The problem is that when a child is very social and communicative he learns the langauge he needs to communicate from daily interactions.

But---if the child is not easily social and communicative, the child may learn langauge but not use it for communication.

Communication comes first.

And the children will communicate most when they learn langaue that is easy and frequent to communicate.

I met a boy on the autistic spectrum recently whose mother proudly showed me four pages of words that the boy knew. He could say them to pictures. For example he know the names of over 45 animal. 20 numbers, 10 colors and so on.

When I looked at the lists, I saw only about 10 words that he was likely to use in daily life to communicate, words like Mom ,Dad, the dog's name, TV

This boy had the serious problem of having a langauge but very little communication.

Be sure to ask yourself- does my child frequently use the wrods he has; if the answer is 'no' then begin communicating with him with words he can practice and use every day such as---me, bus comes here, grandma babysits me I want toast with cinnamon---

One good way to teach a COMMUNICATIVE LANGAUGE IS TO MAKE A PHOTO BOOK- it should have phots of every day activities and things he is experiencing.

Your child's firstmost useful wrods will not be school words like numbers, letters and shapes---they will be words for things the child does frequently, the opjects he deals with, the people and places important to ;him and theexperices he has.

I see our children who are late talking as learning mainly words for school not words for social life.

So everyone, make a photo book and update it with new events and make it you most important communicating book.

Communicating With Teenagers

Sometimes, I read a post on an internet chat group that is a must-share. Carolyn Glass wrote this a couple of years ago in a discussion on the yahoo group, "communicating", and as the discussion this week again turned to communicating with teenagers, I bumped up this old post so that we could revisit it. And this time, I asked Carolyn if I could share her brilliant thoughts on my blog with you. She graciously said yes.

Hey everyone,

I just had an "aha" CP moment about conversations. You've heard Dr. Jim and many others on this list talk about the merits of the CP method for all kinds of children and adults. Well, I discovered it also works like magic with having conversations with typically-developing
teenagers!

Last night, I received the highest form of praise I can imagine coming from my 16-yr-old niece: She called me "my aunt who totally rocks...." I'm adding it to my resume! :) I owe it all to Communicating Partners, because I realized that I have been using CP strategies to get to know her recently (as well as several other nieces and nephews I had previously not known well, since they all live far away).

Here are the CP strategies I have been utilizing. Give them a try...they work wonders!

Matching: I joined Facebook! This niece who now thinks I "rock" is someone I rarely see, who would not dream of writing a letter or even fuss with email, and who says a few polite words to me when we see each other once every few years is a different person on Facebook! I entered her world, spoke her "language," watched first to see how she communicated on FB, then joined in her activity, on her terms. I know that when we see each other in person again (my world!), we will have a much different--more positive--experience, since I first joined her in her world.

Balancing: I am careful to maintain good FB etiquette, not taking too many turns in a row and keeping my conversation pieces short--about as long as hers. If she does not write back to me immediately, I wait "silently but with anticipation" for her to respond. She always does.

Being Responsive: I respond to the little things she says on FB--things she cares about, such as the new hairdo she's sprouting in her new profile picture or responding to a questionairre she has "tagged" me on.

Sharing control: I am careful not to dominate the conversation, but take her lead at least about half the time and introduce my own topics about half the time. I don't deluge her with questions or get "teachy" or "preachy" with her. Then when I have something really important to say, she appears to really listen.

Being Emotionally Connected: We have established a warm, caring relationship with each other. I'll send a private note of condolence when she has posted something about having a rotten day, and we commisserated with each other when we were both missing our "sweeties" (my husband was out of the country for a few weeks and her boyfriend lives in another state). We grumbled together about all the chores we have to get done today, and we came up with a friendly competition to see who can get her housework done first today (she has the unfair advantage of having only her room to clean and little else, but I don't have to go to school today, so we're even!)

I am so enjoying having this new connection with her and all my other nieces and nephews I'm getting to know. Thanks Jim and CP!!!

Carolyn

CONVERSATION, The Key To Success / The Wisdom of "Dr Jim"

Today's blog entry comes from "Dr. Jim", aka, Dr. James D. MacDonald.

CONVERSATION
The Key to Success

Especially for persons with developmental delays such as Autism, Aspergers, Down syndrome, Motor and Attention disorders.

Dr. James D. MacDonald
Professor emeritus, Ohio State University
The Communicating Partners Center, Columbus, Ohio

A personal letter to anyone concerned about someone with problems having conversations.

Imagine a life without conversations. Imagine being isolated from the world without the basic rules of conversation. Imagine having few or no friends because conversation is not easy, natural or enjoyable for you. Imagine having worked hard to learn a lot in school but few around you realize it since a lack of conversations creates a wall between you and society.

Sounds pretty terrible, no?

I know a great many persons who live such lives without conversation. They include both children and adults. Many are persons who are "late to talk" or diagnosed with Autism, Asperger's syndrome, Down syndrome, Neurological and motor disorders, ADD-ADHD, Environmental deprivation and other conditions limiting conversations. Many are typical children who fall through the social cracks without conversational skills and miss much learning and social progress.

I know many persons who succeeded in learning language, only to be just as isolated as they were without language. Why? They did not know how to have conversations. All that hard work learning language may have paid off in schoolwork but not in a real social life. Language without conversation can be like a Mercedes car without gas. Conversation is the key to your child 's learning, socializing, and being truly included.

THINK ABOUT THIS: Consider everything you know and use in daily life---then, ask yourself: How much of that did I learn in school or direct teaching and how much did I learn in daily interactions with life partners? I know that I learn much more from conversations than from direct teaching.

Traditional educational, therapeutic and behavioral programs work very hard teaching children to learn facts, repair problems, and behave acceptably. Unfortunately, little serious attention is usually paid to teaching the conversation skills essential for successful personal and work relationships. Communicating Partners is a program committed to helping every person, regardless of their delays to have a CONVERSATIONAL LIFE.

ALARMING FINDINGS AND MYTHS ABOUT CONVERSATION.

Our 30+years of clinical research reveal several disturbing findings (MacDonald, 2004; MacDonald and Mitchell, 2002) and unsupported beliefs that keep our children from conversational lives.

1. Many believe conversations require a lot of language.
2. School programs require conversation skills for success.
3. Many expect conversations come automatically with language.
4. Consequently, there are very few direct efforts to teach conversation.
5. Many accept questions/answer routines and monologues as satisfactory conversations.
6. Without conversations, people appear less competent than they are.
7. Many do not believe that conversation skills can be learned.
8. Many are unaware that children learn more in conversations than in school.
9. Conversations are often discouraged in education and therapy.
10. Conversation skills are rarely taught in school or therapy.

FINDINGS THAT PROVE THE ASSUMPTIONS WRONG.

Widespread research findings show the above assumptions to be untrue and actually harmful to a child's development. Those research and clinical findings support the conclusions below that are the bases of the Communicating Partners approach to Conversation learning.

1. Fundamental conversation skills can be learned long before speech: the earlier they are learned, the easier a conversation life develops.

2. Many interventions and schools teach cognitive, behavioral and adaptive skills when the children lack conversation skills to put the skills to use in daily life. Without conversation skills, that learning is stored away and wasted.

3. Many educational approaches actually train children to NOT have conversations as a key part of their learning. When children are discouraged from interacting they cannot become conversational.

4. Conversations do not automatically come with language; many children have elaborate language but poor conversation skills,and many are as isolated as when they had no language

5. We cannot consider any assessment of a child's intelligence or other competencies if child has poor conversation skills.Consequently, conversation skills will reveal the real child. Remember, conversation begins at birth, so we are talking about any meaningful social exchange as a conversation. Question assessments that do not include easy playful interactions.

6. Conversations simply mean going back and forth meaningfully with partners with any behaviors-actions, sounds, as well as words. Consequently, children need to learn conversation rules long before they talk. ---Rules such as Initiating and Responding to people, Playing more with people than things, Imitating and modeling others, Turntaking and Taking the other person's perspective. Each of these skills can begin very early in life, when their life partners enter the child's world.

7. Partners must help children have conversations with actions and sounds first-Without that learning children are likely to use language mainly to satisfy needs and perform. And real relationships do not happen that way.

8. Conversation can be learned as well as other social skills: The five responsive strategies of Communicating Partners are the key to becoming conversational. Many parents have helped children have conversational vs. isolated lives.

9. Clearly we learn and retain much more information that we get from daily conversations than from being directly taught. The social process makes learning more lasting and enjoyable.

10. Children learn much more in social contacts than in academic or behavioral drills, especially when those contacts are conversational. Do not expect your child to learn conversations in school. One to one intimate interactions are needed.

11. And remember, the major problem in for our children is SOCIAL ISOLATION AND LONELINESS, not lack of school-learning. Consequently, if INCLUSION is what you want for your child, CONVERSATIONS ARE THE KEY not academic learning.

For practical programs for building conversational lives, see
COMMUNICATING PARTNERS.: www.jamesdmacdonald.org
E-mail: macdonald.3@osu.edu and
the key book: Communicating Partners ( Amazon.com etc)

Dr. Jim: Red Flags, Green Flags, Which do you follow?

Here is a copy of The Red flags-Green flags idea you can share with others. Dr. Jim


RED FLAGS - GREEN FLAGS
Which do you follow?

Parents frequently tell me about the ‘red flags’ that professionals claim to see in their child.
‘Red flags’ are signs of autistic-like or delayed behavior---such as severe language delay, lining up cars, flicking his hands, isolating himself, not talking to others, repeating actions or communications and many more ‘suspicious’ behaviors.

Seldom do people stop and ask: Does the child show as many positive social behaviors as the ‘red flags’ that appear? The diagnosis of autism, PDD or Asperger’s is often based on these ‘red flags’ without accounting for two critical things; ‘green flags ‘ developmentally correct behavior that is not autistic-like, and recent changes showing productive social and communicative behavior.

These ‘green flags” and recent changes show that for some children, autistic behavior is a developmental matter more than a long-term disorder.

Some professionals seek out negative signs, focus on the obvious differences and ignore positive ones that I call “green flags.” This results in unreliable and invalid assessment and treatment.

A green flag is a behavior that shows the child is developing in skills that show he is not autistic or delayed all the time. It also suggests that he is even developing out of autistic habits.

Common green flags include playing with others, initiating or responding to others’ contacts, playing functionally and not repeatedly, communicating to others more than to himself, showing more interest in people, using language socially, occasionally having reciprocal conversations, cooperating, showing empathy and many other skills that can be built into the effective social life that defines success in autism.

A global ‘green flag’ occurs when the child is showing fewer ‘red flags’ over time or when they are less autistic-like in certain environments. It is now clear that autistic behavior is not everywhere and with everyone. Autistic behavior varies as the child’s environments vary.

WHY ARE RED AND GREEN FLAGS IMPORTANT?

When a child is seen as a list of Red flags, people often attend more to negative behaviors and less to positive ones that a can be built socially. Attending to red flags can result in increasing them.

Focusing on red flags often frightens parents into a state where all they see is negative things. Red flags depress parents and a depressed parent often gives up or gives up opportunities to help the child themselves. They give professionals many tasks that only they as parents can do at home in their daily interactions.

Red flags can get parents into a habit of getting rid of behaviors rather than building positive behaviors (Green flags)

Focusing on “green flags” gives parents hope and motivation based on clear evidence. “Green flags” show how the child is developing and where support is immediately needed. They give the parents a place to start to have successes. We find that when parents and professionals respond to the ‘green flags’ they get more of them. Often the most effective beginning goal for a child is to have him do more of their green flags and do them in interactions with people who are matching, balancing and responding to them. Parents will even find that there are ‘red flag” and ‘green flag” people, that is ones who their child does poorly or well with.

Discuss the “green flags’ with your family and others so everyone is supporting your child’s progress rather than focusing on his problems. Use the red flag-green flag approach in your IEP plans with the school. Specify the value of including green flags in the goals so the child has some success to encourage him through the difficult goals.

KEEP A PARALLEL LIST OF RED FLAGS AND GREEN FLAGS
Use the list to have a balanced view of your child. The list will show you what behaviors (Green flags) you should respond to and build into your interactions and which behaviors (Red flags) you should ignore so you don’t inadvertently develop them.

MY CHILD’S RED FLAGS AND GREEN FLAGS

A red flag is a sign of problems.

A green flag is a strength or progress.

RED FLAGS GREEN FLAGS

INTERACTIVE BEHAVIORS

LEARNING ON HIS OWN-COGNITIVE.

NONVERBAL COMMUNICATION

SOCIAL LANGUAGE

CONVERSATION

CIVIL BEHAVIOR

MOTOR DEVELOPMENT

HOUSEHOLD ACTIVITIES

MEDICAL ISSUES

ENVIRONMENTAL ISSUES

FRIENDSHIPS

OTHER DEVELOPMENTAL CONCERNS

Please see the ARM for many developmental steps.

See other maps or assessments or program plans.


Copyright 2010 James MacDonald
http://www.communicatingpartners.com/

Consequences of Adults Talking Too Much by Dr James MacDonald

Wish I had met Dr Jim much earlier in my daughter's journey.

PARTNER TALKS SO MUCH THE CHILD GETS TOO LITTLE PRACTICE.

Why is this a problem?:
Not enough practice for a conversation habit.
Learns to be passive.
Learns to talk only about others ideas.
Fails to learn turn-taking.
Believes his ideas are not important.
Partner usually gives talking models that are too complicated.
Conversation are short lived when one person runs the show.
CONVERSATION LEADS TO A SOCIAL LIFE MORE THAN LANGUAGE ITSELF.

What can you do to help?

THINK OF CONVERSATION AS A GIVE AND TAKE, A PING-PONG
GAME NOT A LECTURE OR A TEST.
Wait silently for partner to have his turn.
Clearly expect and anticipate him to participate.
Allow his turn at times to be physical and nonverbal.
Accept and respond to a turn even if it is unclear.
Let person know that you want the conversation to continue.
Remind your self that he will learn more when you do only half.
Your child learns language best in conversations.
Make conversation out of physical interactions.

EXAMPLE:
LESS LIKE THIS

MOM: Your birthday’s coming. What do you think you will get? I bet Grandma will get you clothes again. Who will get you toys? What toys do you want?
Child: Computer games. The ones that...
M: Interrupting. Oh not more of those. you just hide way and get stuck on those.
C: You can play with me on the computer.
M: Oh you know I am always busy. And I don’t understand what you see in them.
C: You could learn.
M: Oh I have too much to do.


EXAMPLE
MORE LIKE THIS:

MOM: Birthday’s coming. Waits looking at child.
Child: I want a train cake. With an engine and a caboose.
M: Any tender cars?
C: Yes one for pigs and horses.
M: They might fight together.
C: Okay, lets have two tender cars.



CONVERSATIONS DEVELOP BEST WHEN BOTH PARTNERS PARTICIPATE AS MUCH AS THE OTHER.
THE CHILD LEARNS MORE LANGUAGE TOO.
James D.MacDonald

From the yahoo group "communicating", a list comprised of parents and professionals who are currently utilizing or are interested in helping children with various learning disAbilities learn to communicate effectively by using the methods of Dr. James D. MacDonald of "Communicating Partners." Dr Jim generously allows members to share his tips and advice with others. Thank you, Dr Jim!

Dr. Jim's Thanksgiving Letter

As the holidays arrive, here's Communicating Partners', Dr James D MacDonald's "Thanksgiving Letter" to extended family, written from the perspective of the parent of a child who is delayed in communication, speech, and language. It's good enough to share.

Dr. Jim wrote:

Dear Family Members:

My child can do more than you think!

Interact WITH not AT my child.

Enter physically in his world and observe him silently for a short while.

Become aware of his interests and ability level.

Then, gently join into his activity without disrupting it.

Do what the child is doing.

Do not do a lot more than he is doing- but be active.

Match his movements; act in ways he can try to do.

Respond to his movements with similar, related movements.

Talk about the here and now, about the child's experiences.

Be animated: be more interesting than what is distracting him.

Do more of what you do when he stays with you.

Do less of what you do when he leaves you.

Match his speech: talk in ways he can now talk (this will help him talk more.)

Respond to his speech: show him you are interested.

Wait silently for him to take his turn.

Don't praise him: enjoy him instead; your response is the best reward.

Take turns with action and talk: be sure to give and take.

If you don't understand him, treat it as a foreign language and simply give him an English word that fits the situation.

Limit your questions and demands: comment instead.

Bottom line: the more you enjoy each other, the more my child will learn with you.

First Words -- thoughts from "Dr Jim"

I wish I'd heard of Dr Jim (Dr James MacDonald from Communicating Partners) before I heard of ABA. He posted on his yahoo group ("communicating") over the weekend, and he was writing about us, about what we did wrong. Please learn from our mistakes. I blogged about some of our experience here and about how finally finding RDI(r) got us back on the right track. RDI(r) and Communicating Partners are different developmental interventions that share some similarities.

Dr Jim's post is below.

I have known many children who have learned words for many school type learning- words for colors, shapes, numbers.

Why can that be a problem?

Those words are not very communicative; in daily interactions they are not the meanings we communicate about. So while the child may store them for being tested, they are not words that they will use and practice much.

Think of words coming from the child's experiences and reasons to communicate.

When you ask yourself: what should a child say now- ask: what does he know and what is he doing and what does he want to tell someone?

Those three questions will give you words that he is ready to speak and communicate.

What should his next words be? His next words should be combinations of words he knows singly. They should also be new words that describe what he is doing, experiencing and wanting to tell someone.

Help your child talk from his real self not just from list of words he learns in school or the things you think he needs to know. He will talk more when he is talking from his own experiences.

One thing you can do is translate he actions, sounds and experiences into one or a few words. Think of his actions and sound as 'pre-words" ideas that he is ready to learn in word form.

My notes from Dr MacDonald's presentation

Communicating Partners' Dr Jim (Dr James D MacDonald) presented to a group of local parents and professionals this week, and of course, I went.

We're an RDI(r) family and I discovered Dr Jim's and CP recently. Dr Jim teaches parents about how to be communicating partners with their children, a developmental approach that shares many similarities w/ RDI(r) and Dr Jim chats with parents on a yahoo group called "communicating" in a way that is similar to the way RDI(r)'s Dr Gutstein used to connect with parents on the internet.

I very much enjoy the way Dr Jim words concepts for parents. I'm not new to a developmental approach. I know this stuff. Sometimes he sounds so much like Dr Gutstein, and Dr Jim's choice of words teaches me even deeper insights about the stuff I know. Sometimes Dr Jim's description of a concept is just enough "same but different" that I see that old concept in a really fresh, new way. He stretches me and grows me.

Rather than type all of my notes, I thought I'd try to "cheat" and scan them. If you double click on the photo, you should be able to see the entire first page of notes I scribbled during his presentation (or you can simply read the highlights, because, yes, I'm going to type them):

Highlights: MAKE YOURSELF "POSSIBLE" FOR YOUR CHILD. Too much of what we do makes ourselves "impossible" for them. Children w/ communication delays need lots of interaction with people who are "possible" for them.

Major Problems: We adults are too much, too soon, too adult when we interact with the child, and we give the child too little time to process, respond an initiate.

Slow down to the child's pace. Wait more. Make yourself "possible". Only do as much as the child does. DO NOT FILL THE SPACE THAT HE NEEDS TO LEARN IN.

Developmental age is more important than chronological age.

Communicate, not perform.

Your child is going to learn to communicate with you. Or NOT. It's up to you.

Focus on the positive things and the negative things will go away. Don't talk to nasty behavior. We tend to end up paying attention to the behavior we don't want and ignoring the behavior that we want.

CP is a developmental series that follows a developmental map, the ARM, based on 30 years of clinical research.

DON'T ASK THE CHILD QUESTIONS! WE ASK OUR CHILDREN WAY TOO MANY QUESTIONS!

PRETEND HE IS A HUMAN BEING AND NOT A DIAGNOSIS!

Conversations are for CONNECTIONS, not for information. Conversations don't have to make sense! Experiment w/ sounds as conversation.

He talked about autism as a myth, like the tooth fairy, and he says that the majority (80% or more) of professionals BELIEVE IN AUTISM, and don't believe these kids need more processing time and interaction at a non-verbal level. ***I love that idea -- let's all say we don't believe in autism! ;) ***

The rest of my notes are mostly statements Dr Jim made. Page two of my notes begins with the statement: "So much of bad behavior is taking the wrong turn."

"The more YOU do, the less your child can do." (stop doing so much!)

STIMMING = "safe smoking" Dr Jim showed video footage of him working with a young boy who was quite a stimmer, and Dr Jim ignored the stimming and began to interact with the boy, tossing a pillow back and forth. Dr Jim said that smokers can communicate while they are smoking a cigarrette, and smoking is a stim, so don't try to stop the kids from stimming.

"Be responsive to your child as if he were communicating to you"

"Imitate spontaneous behavior. If he scratches his head, you scratch your head."

"Respond to your child's sounds and words, and THEN WAIT"

"SHOW HIM LANGUAGE. NOT TEST HIS LANGUAGE!"

"Don't do more than the child does. If you'll follow that rule, he will do more!"

Matching - interests as well as abilities

"The more you enjoy your child, the more he will learn from you."

"Do the unexpected - don't be boring."

Dr Jim says that the statement 'If a child isn't talking by the age of five or six he'll never talk,' is NONSENSE

And, referring to non-verbal, pre-speech foundations of communication, Dr Jim said, "MOST THERAPISTS AND TEACHERS ARE TAUGHT AT THE WORD LEVEL. WE NEED TO LEARN AND GROW WHAT HAPPENS BEFORE THE WORD LEVEL!"

What To Share With Others About Your Child

A Guide To What To Share With Others About Your Child,

by Communicating Partner's

Dr James D MacDonald

Welcome to Summer,

Since you and your child may be spending time with some new people or family this summer, you will have the chance to invite them to help your child interact and communicate more. The hopefully more relaxed times of summer often help children make real gains in socializing.

As your child meets more and more people, you can help him a great deal by coaching family and friends in ways that help him socialize and communicate. The more people he interacts with the more he will learn and the and less alone he will be.

Anyone who knows your child can help.

You might begin with a few suggestions, such as

“ Say one thing them wait for him” or
“ Make the sounds he makes.” or
“ Talk about what he is doing” or
“ Question less and comment more” or
“ You don’t have to talk, playing quiet will help him.”
“ He does best when you act like him.” And
“ She can do a lot more than you may expect.”

Show and discuss this with anyone spending much time with your child— family, sitters, teachers, and aides. Keep this list in your purse or wallet so you get in the habit of changing your child’s world in his favor. Be proud of your child and find new friends for him or her.

Let us know how it works.

Dr. Jim

HOW YOU CAN HELP MY CHILD DEVELOP.

When a child is delayed or not socially outgoing, he or she needs people to interact in different ways than is typical. When a child has autism pdd, aspergers, Down syndrome, cerebral palsy or other conditions effecting communication, they have special needs of their life partners if they are to learn and build relationships with them. Think of the guides below similar to ones you would give to people if you had a child with diabetes, heart problems, allergies, special fears, or different learning styles. For example, for a diabetic child, you would let everyone know how to and how not to feed and treat them. Similarly with “late talking children” we need to let their life partners know how to interact so the child will show his best and so they will truly see what the child can really do.

HELLO! You can really help my child develop. You do not need training; you just need to be his partner. The more real friends he has now, the more he will learn and fit in the world.

Thanks for connecting and helping my child grow.

“_____’__” Family.

*My child can do more than you think!

*My child will learn, communicate and care about you more when you do some of the following:

*Interact WITH not AT my child.

*Enter physically in his world and observe him silently for a short while.

*Become aware of his interests and ability level.

*Then, gently join into his activity without disrupting it.

*Do what the child is doing.

*Do not do a lot more than he is doing- but be active.

*Match his movements; act in ways he can try to do.

*Respond to his movements with similar, related movements.

*Talk about the here and now, about the child’s experiences.

*Be animated: be more interesting than what is distracting him.

*Do more of what you do when he stays with you

*Do less of what you do when he leaves you.

*Match his speech: talk in ways he can now talk (this will help him talk more.)

*Respond to his speech: show him you are interested.

*Wait silently for him to take his turn

*Don’t just praise him: enjoy him instead; your response is the best reward.

*Take turns with action and talk: be sure to give and take.

*If you don’t understand him, treat it as a foreign language and simply give him an English word that fits the situation.

*Limit your questions and demands: comment instead.

*Bottom line: the more you enjoy each other, the more my child will learn with you.

PS: ALL OF THIS WILL HELP YOUR CHILD BE MORE SOCIAL AND COMMUNICATIVE AND LEARN MORE.

"Academic Communicator" vs "Social Communicator"

A couple of days ago, I wrote about the importance of focusing on "social communication" FIRST. (Click HERE for that blog entry.)

I've gotten some questions from parents this week asking me, "What about speech therapy?" They want to know how you grow speech in a child who is developmentally delayed.

My answer, is to trust development.

Go back and get the non-verbal, pre-speech foundations and ignore words and "talk". Focus on "developmentally appropriate" and let the other "stuff" go until the other "stuff" is developmentally appropriate.

We have seen so many functions and skills begin to emerge and grow without ever working on the directly. By focusing on developmentally appropriate instead of addressing behavior out of sequence, we work more naturally, and it doesn't feel like "work" in the way a behavioral program did.

The best developmental chart I've found on the internet is the Adult Child Relationship Map by Dr James D MacDonald of Communicating Partners.

Learning about development first, intervening from a developmentally appropriate point for your child is a key to his/her experience and growth. Learn about development (not behavior) and trust development.

Responsibility to Grow at Your Own Pace

I have had the privilege and pleasure to know several adults who are on the autism spectrum for many years. They have been wonderful teachers to me. They continue to remind us parents to be mindful of how we speak about our children in front of them and to be mindful of any unintended but negative non-verbal messages we may be sending to them.

Here's another reminder, and this one comes from a professional, and the message applies to all of our relationships.

Penny

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Today's entry is a guest post from Communicating Partner's Dr. James MacDonald. Thank you, Dr. MacDonald, for allowing me to use your words here on my blog, to share with other parents. You are a great teacher. The source: a post on the yahoo group, "communicating".

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"The problem, a huge, I see on this topic is that when we show a child we want from him things he cannot do he becomes to think that

I AM WRONG.
That can pervade all he does.

I constantly tell parents and professionals who will listen that each behavior you consider a mistake or error or delay is just a developmental step.

The problem is that if you respond to behaviors as 'wrong" then the child will stop, feel wrong and do less.

I just met as little girl who has been diagnosed with several things like PDD, ASD, dd, etc.

Thanks to her parents, she doesn't seem to know this or think differently about herself.

So when you call a child delayed or slow, be very careful. No child is delayed or slow except in comparison to same a ged children.

I know many very able le people who have learned others think they are delayed or wrong and then when they begin to think that of themselves, they try less and do less.

I am sure each of you know someone, hopefully not yourself, who has felt wrong or not just right, and then they do in life much less than they really could do.

I hope you learn that taking the attitude that "my child is who she is, period." and not act as thought there is something wrong with her.

If you want your child to do more, then join her world and show her how. Too often professionals are pushing our children to do things they are not developmentally ready for and then when the therapy or school fails, the child is blamed.

Everyone has a responsibility to grow at his own pace. COMPARISONS ARE HATEFUL, because you can never be someone else and if you try you will be unhappy and unsuccessful.

Dr. Jim"

Three Good Reminders from Dr James MacDonald

Today's blog entry is published with permission from Communicating Partners' Dr. James MacDonald.

HOW OLD IS YOUR CHILD?

Developmental age is much more important for learning than his chronological age. WHY?

How old is your child? And what should he be doing now?

You need to know that your child has several developmental ages.

You will be successful when you fit your goals to his developmental ages.

A developmental age is the one he does a task at. For example: Even if Sammy is 6 in years (chronologically) , he may run like he’s five. Draw like he’s four. Understand you like he’s three. Talk like he’s two, and cry like he’s one. Even when he is actually six years old. The point is that you need to teach him at each developmental age so he can learn with you. Teaching or expecting six year old Sammy to talk or understand llike a six-year-old will just spell failure for each of you.

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WHAT SHOULD I EXPECT FROM MY CHILD?

More of what he has already done and just a little more of what he is already doing! When you expect too much of your child, you often do more than he can do. When you expect too much, he learns he cannot succeed with you. When you expect too much he is unlikely to spend much learning time with you.

What to Do?

Every child can do a little more than he is now doing..help by expecting a little more action, sound, or word. You will help by showing him a little next step. When you do this, he will succeed and he will stay to learn more with you. If you do too much he may think he is a failure.Your child will do more when you expect and show him one step above.

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WAIT FOR A SURPRISE Your child can do much more than you think! When I wait for a child she often surprises me by doing something I did not think she could do! You may think you know your child well. I find that children know much more than we expect. The more you wait silently the more your child will DO things you did not know she could do, SAY things you did not know she could say. Let you know her better. Allow you to get closer to her world, interact with you more. Learn that she can have successes with you.

Wait and let your child surprise you with what he can do.

Communicating Partners 2009

More reflections on the "radar" of parent of children w/ developmental delays

"Out of rational fear, many of us tell the child (usually nonverbally) I WILL TAKE CARE OF YOU NO MATTER WHAT. And it can be just that unnecessary 'taking care' that keeps the child in a learned helplessness, or as I prefer, a LAZY mode of operating."

"Think of your job now as catching yourself when you are about to do for your child when he needs to do for himself... "

--Dr. James D. MacDonald from Communicating Partners

We spent over three years working with our daughter from a strict behavioral perspective, demanding behavioral compliance from her, and teaching her many words and concepts. After all of that heavy-hitting early intervention, I still needed to use my radar for things that I shouldn't have. None of that early intervention translated to success in an age-appropriate kindergarten classroom or at Sunday School or birthday parties or grocery shopping.

We completely MISSED non-verbal, pre-speech foundations of communication with this behavioral approach. We missed the things infants and babies experience, like reciprocity, emotion sharing, referencing faces for meaning. Interaction begins NON-verbally, and through all of our early intervention efforts, we missed that.

A switch to a developmental approach was quite a shift for us, for me.

Almost five years ago, we chose RDI(r). RDI(r) was the only developmental program out there for a child my age, I THOUGHT. (I was so wrong! Now, I know that there are others. Communicating Partners is one. Floortime is for younger children, and Son Rise, Gentle Teaching, and Feuerstein Instrumental Enrichment all come from that developmental perspective.)

Overdeveloped "Mommy Radar" is necessary, but left unchecked, can create learned helplessness and passivity, a "lazy mode of operating" in a child. One of the things that Dr Gutstein from RDI(r) helped me recognize when we began is the fact that many children with delays in communication and interaction are very passive. He taught me that my daughter needs to physically feel herself taking an action, reaching, stretching, gathering her own information. NON-verbally. WITH me. Combining active participation and interdependence.

Here's an example: Before I began learning about a developmental approach, I would dress my daughter without her help. I could put a coat on a limp child in no time, sliding her coat sleeves up her arms, zipping the coat in a flash. I'd be working with her on some behavioral program while I was dressing her, asking her to show me an action or touch a body part. At meal time, I'd place her food in front of her while working on another verbal, stimulus/response-type q & a from our behavioral program.

I gave her the experience, "Getting ready means Mom dresses me. I don't have to do anything. It's all her job. I don't even need to pay attention to events happening around me. Mom will prompt me for anything I need to know, including when it's time to leave, time to eat. Instead, Mommy and other adults will ask me lots of questions and I have to give the right answer."

Dr. MacDonald from Communicating Partners and Play to Talk delivers a similar message using a different word picture. I love Dr. MacDonald's phrase about putting a child in a lazy mode of operating -- that's an accurate description of what we did, accidentally, while we were working on other skills in early intervention, with hearts of gold and good intentions. I've always thought of it as mindlessness (because RDI(r) reminds parents to be "mindful"). I do like that word picture: putting a child in a lazy mode of operating when we do not allow the child to do the things he can do for himself.

We also gave her the really bizarre experience that communication is about our asking her questions and her responding with the one correct answer. (Can you imagine the anxiety you'd have if the only communication you were only allowed is to answer questions with one right answer?)

So, not only was she not feeling herself taking an action, but she was also experiencing communication very differently from the rest of us.

I listened to Dr Gutstein's words (she needs to feel herself taking an action with me) and wondered how I'd begin to create opportunities for active participation with a child who was not interested? The only way I could interact with her was to engage in one of the stimulus/reward situations that we'd both memorized and practiced over and over. If I didn't prompt her verbally in some way, she simply ignored me, shut me out.

After I made the switch away from a behavioral approach, I began using myself differently. Silently, I'd hold her coat open, wait for her to take her own action and notice, and then I'd wait for her to insert her own arm into a sleeve, and wait for her to insert her other arm. I might start the zipper, get it on track, and wait for her to notice that it wasn't zipped all the way, and allow her time to notice and zip it. Slowing down and being quiet were required of me to make these opportunities happen.

And at snack time, I learned to hold a gfcf cookie or banana toward her and wait for her to notice, and reach her own arm out and accept it, and to avoid the temptation to use it as a reward in order to get her to touch her nose or name the fruit or some other verbal, behavioral task. Accepting a treat as a reward for responding to a stimulus had not given her the sense of being an active participant. I had to learn and recognize that non-verbal reciprocity, these silent interactions, were necessary foundations of communication that we had missed and needed to go back and get. (I changed my focus to non-verbal precursors and foundations to communication, giving her experience as --to borrow from Dr MacDonald-- a "communicating partner", and shift from a focus on "verbal behavior".) I needed to recognize ways in which I had been doing both parts of the interaction, hers and mine, and begin to give her responsibility for her part and the time she needed to accomplish it.

I began to learn, as Dr MacDonald says "to catch myself when I am about to do for my child when she needs to do for herself." And that involves allowing her to reach for herself, shift her own head, eyes, attention (without my prompting), which means I must slow down in order to give her the processing time and space she needs to become active with me, not passive or "lazy".

For children with delays in communication, those "catch yourself" times include times when the child needs to shift his own gaze and his own attention, insert his own arm into his own coat, or his foot into his sock and shoe, accept his own plate, fork, spoon, cup as you are setting the table, carry his side of a bag of groceries with us, and more.

And, the more I think about it, the more I look at how I am with all of my children. It's not just about kids w/ developmental delays! I think I need to cross stitch Dr. MacDonald's words or print them onto a poster for my wall, because I still recognize that I "do" for all of my children when they need to be "doing" for themselves. And they hate it when I make a new discovery and begin to hand over to them the responsibility that should be theirs. I realized in the last few weeks that I have one child who ASKS me for reminders. That child's experience is, "I don't have to remember because Mom will remember for me."

We are all works in progress, some of us (me) have more work than others. The more I learn about myself, the more work I seem to have to do. :)

Mommy Radar and Learned Helplessness

We parents of children with developmental delays like autism (not limited to autism, though) realize intuitively, very early, that our kids aren't able to share attention with us, and, as an unintentional result, we parents over-develop a kind of "radar" that has us thinking one step, five steps, ten steps ahead of our children. *grin* You know what I'm talkin' about -- the way we can scan a strange room on a first visit, or a park or playground, the way we look for exits, objects that could be mouthed, articles that could be broken, it's like the stuff we do with typical toddlers, except it's on overdrive (maybe even on steroids!) and it lasts waaaaaaaaaaay past toddlerhood!

Those parents don't get to relax, because anywhere they go with that child, that radar must always be working due to the child's underdeveloped joint attention.

That radar becomes a necessity, because if we're not a few steps ahead of them, POOF, they can be gone out a hole in the fence at the playground in a flash! Or they can pick up a glass "pretty" at someone's house and demolish it faster than we can blink! Or eat something they shouldn't.

So, this radar overdevelops, and we don't turn it off at home -- we quit being aware of it and it becomes our way of being with our kid. We get so good at it, that a GREAT DEAL OF THE TIME, we can intuitively read that child's communication SO WELL, that we reinforce learned helplessness in them.

Sound familiar? The child's experience is this one: I don't have to communicate my needs, because Mom watches me with her radar and does that for me, even when we're at home and in familiar territory.

And then all h-e-double-hockey-sticks breaks loose on the rare occasions when Mom's radar FAILS and the result is that we set off an incredible tantrum or meltdown, (the HANDLE approach calls 'em "flare ups").

The "radar" works because we, the parent, assume responsibility for the child, too. I can remember hanging on to my daughter's wrist to keep her near me, or she would bolt while we were running errands. But, I'd wind up overcompensating in places where I could have chosen differently, like at home. You know what I'm talking about: We do OUR part of the interaction, and the CHILD's part, too.

Holding BOTH sides of the responsibility ALL THE TIME is a heavy weight.

Here's something I learned, and I am still learning: If you want to shift the responsibility to your child of communicating her own needs, you need to change yourself, change what you are reinforcing with your "radar".

Are any of these your child? (they were mine, ironically after more than 3 years of early intervention and ABA)

"I don't have to shift my own attention because someone always does that for me by calling my name or using some other prompt"

or

"I don't have to show Mom what I want because she always knows what's in my mind. I don't have to know what's in hers."

or

"I don't have to watch for clues around me that a transition is about to happen, because someone will do that for me with prompts and reminders and compensations."

I posted my realization on a Yahoo group where Dr. James MacDonald of Communicating Partners joins parents as we learn how to use ourselves differently with our children, and his response to my post was helpful to me as I continue to think about how to use my "radar". He generously gave me permission to use his words, here. Here are some brilliant highlights from Dr. MacDonald.:

"The dilemma we all have is that we need to predict and protect our children but at the same time give them time and expect more of them.

It is difficult but critical to know the difference.

Let's try to develop in our selves some kind of wisdom or intuition that tells us DANGER or NO DANGER so we can stop and protect when we need to, but also, so we can let the child be himself and respond when we can.

So let's get in the habit of asking ourselves--DANGER OR NO DANGER?

When it is NO DANGER, let your child be free and then respond and make it interactive.

Out of rational fear, many of us tell the child (usually nonverbally) I WILL TAKE CARE OF YOU NO MATTER WHAT. And it can be just that unnecessary 'taking care' that keeps the child in a learned helplessness,or as I prefer, a LAZY mode of operating. So let's get into a habit of knowing quickly when to PROTECT--and when to MOVE ON. Think of your job now as catching yourself when you are about to do for your child when he needs to do for himself...

Remember our job is to prepare our children for relationships with people who will not CARE as much as we do.

Carolyn was right=== put on a stranger hat and act like a stranger would by not doing for the children what he can do for himself. You will find that most of the time you and your child can move on and only rarely do you really need him to protect."

The highlighted text are the parts that stuck out for me as I continue to figure out how best to use my "radar" to help my child to interact and communicate.

Charlotte Mason wrote extensively about habit formation -- Dr. MacDonald's words about a "lazy mode of operating," remind me of Mason's words about the importance that children develop a "habit of attention", which prompt me to dig up some Charlotte Mason materials in order to study her words more closely. Here's one link, if you are interested, too.

Thanks, Dr. MacDonald, for allowing me to share your words.